mortgage…

Society is what makes “marriage” marriage. Whether that’s marriage as we know it in the Western world, or marriage as, for example, certain Sherpa groups know it in Nepal where it’s polyandrous. It’s a societal institution and a societal constraint.

Fortunately, I am covered under a health insurance policy that covers domestic partners, so we don’t need to be legally married in order for her to be covered by my insurance.

This is not even the beginning of all the reasons to get married, as marriage currently exists. What about visitation rights if one of you gets ill? If, hypothetically, your family hated her, they could “rightfully” keep her out. This is just one of the problems gays have…

To me, marriage is a religious ceremony

Here I am in great disagreement. The ceremonial aspects of marriage are what one couple make of it. I am married, and happily so (yes, I know I asked I AM if he dated readers - it was a joke, and if the engaged Delta can joke he’s I AM’s appointed reader dater, I am obviously not the only one with a warped sense of humor). My husband is also an atheist (I would have it no other way). Our marriage ceremony had nothing to do with god, and we were very specific on that with our officiant. I’ll admit that part of why I wanted to get married was societal influence… how can it not be? From legal, medical and sociological/cultural perspectives, it is the “thing” to do - hell, I’ll even admit I like the trappings of it, the white dress, the pretty sandals… but at the end of the evening, I had married my husband because I love him, because I wanted the ceremonial commitment. I wanted to promise, in front of friends and family, that we would love each other through everything life throws at us. Maybe it’s silly, but I don’t have god. For me, that makes the ceremonial aspects of marriage all the more important. I wasn’t vowing to love him so I could have sex. Heck, I’d been doing that for some time already… it wasn’t about some heavenly father’s design for our lives. It was about our design for our lives, and our expression of who we are, both as individuals and a couple. Maybe, despite being a cynical atheist, I also happen to be a serious romantic… but marriage can be meaningful without god, and I am sure there are others out here who would agree with that.

Now, maybe, Bruce, you want to argue that all ceremonies have some sort of religious roots… maybe, say, graduations? A diploma and a marriage certificate, at the end of the day, are no different. With the diploma, you’ve completed the necessary coursework, but the document makes it “legitimate”, at least theoretically. Same with marriage, in an ideal world. Ideally, you want to spend the rest of your life with that person and you love that person, despite their flaws (though my husband, of course, has none :P). I didn’t need the piece of paper to make it official… but I won’t deny that, despite feeling marriage as an institution is pointless and silly, I like being married. I like having a husband - but not because society has me convinced I should (which is unfortunately the case with too many of my friends).

The problem with marriage isn’t what gays might do to it… it’s what heterosexuals have done to it since, well, likely since the beginning. I have no doubts that gays would eventually do the same, if given the right to wed. It’s not about straight or gay. It’s about human nature and societal/cultural pressures. My husband and I may be exceptions to the standard… but we’re in the minority.

As for I AM being apathetic to gay marriage, I don’t think that means he’s homophobic or anti-gay rights. Can you honestly say that there isn’t a single issue that fails to elicit an emotional response from you, Bruce? I know I can’t say that… there are plenty of issues I don’t really care about. That doesn’t mean I am opposed to them.

Boywonder, you actually touched upon part of the debate I was having via email with I AM. I don’t feel that marriage really promotes benefits for society. I think that’s what certain people want to believe (and here you certainly add the religious component)… but at the end of the day, couples who aren’t married but love each other and have good relationships raise children, and married couples can hate each other and yet insist on remaining married and fail their children because of the conflicts in their relationship.

Marriage happens far too often because it’s supposed to. It ends because people find it easier to walk away then to fight for something they believed in once. It’s easier, somehow, to wipe the slate clean and start anew for far too many people. I very sincerely don’t think it would be any different for gays if marriage were legalized for them. Maybe slightly at first, because contrary to what Bruce seems to think, it would be a “new” right. It might take them a few years to screw it up as royally because it would be a novelty.

Now, for the record, I am not saying there aren’t cases where divorce is clearly the right option… but divorce has become far too easy, and marriage isn’t taken seriously. Hell, over half the married couples I know don’t even share bank accounts - and they think my husband and I are freaks because we have a joint account (and, incidentally, did even before we got married).

Society tells us we should get married, and GeneralZod’s comment illustrates this nicely. I didn’t get married because of that pressure, but I won’t deny it was a relief to have it end… now, don’t even get me started on how children are entered into the mix for the same reasons - because that’s what we’re “supposed to do”… if there wasn’t so much pressure coming from so many angles to get married, I bet the divorce rates would sharply drop.

Feel free to email me (anyone) if you’d like to continue the debate, but I get the sense I AM has had enough. god_addict_no_more@yahoo.com.

ANM